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Posted By: Harry Watley on August 04, 2009

I have an IQ of 68. I am barely passed the threshold of retardation. On the other hand, I consider that all of you have an IQ of at least average or above average intelligence.

Yet, it boggles the little common sense I have that you all could whine and complain day after day about everything that are wrong in White America’s system towards Black Americans. However, when offered a permanent solution, none of you appreciates the solution of sovereignty or complete independence on a portion of this continent that you could call your very own country, with borders.

It is the same as when God offered the Hebrew people Exodus out of Egypt, the Hebrew people would refuse that Exodus and tell God their bondage is just fine. How insane that you!

One hundred percent of Black Americans, young and old, educated and dumb have said to me that they would not want to live in an ideal situation if American Blacks, e.g. themselves, govern it. Some Blacks have said to me that their complete independence is not realistic or feasible. Some have said that even if God offered autonomy to us, White America would not allow our sovereignty to happen.

As I said, I have an IQ of 68, and it boggles my mind for what reason did Miss Harriet Tubman risked her life during the underground railroad era to free the slaves that today’s descendents of those slaves would not accept God’s offer of complete independence. It is just mind-boggling for me.

Does anyone have a positive suggestion for me?

What say you?
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Business/Systems Analyst at MITC
Harry, let me say this, and what I am about to say I offer in all sincerity and not in any way, shape or form as a putdown.

You say you have an IQ of 68. You seem to accept that there are limitations that come with such a level of capability, based on what you have written here. I personally do not view IQ tests as absolute, as they tend to be more a measure of acculturation than actual thinking ability.

That said, however, it would seem to me that if you have experienced 100% rejection of your idea, that you should realize that maybe its time to consider some possibilities, other than the one you keep repeating ad nauseum; that the reason no one is taking you up on it is because black people “must” be too stupid to grasp what you are saying, essentially. So its time to consider something else; maybe your approach is not effective in getting across the message you are trying to impart. That maybe the problem is not us; its you.

Now you may or may not know that it is said that doing something over and over and expecting a different result is the definition of insanity. I am by no means saying that is the case with you; however this is what you have done. But I am more inclined to lean in that direction when you state the problem here and yet it is not obvious to you that you cannot expect a different result when doing the same thing.

Now, the flaw in your approach is this: you offer no vision as to (a) what this new land would be, other than “black”; (b) the process by which this will come about; (c) any idea of government, etc.; (d) any steps that we should/could be doing now to make this happen. As I have stated before, black separatist movements are nothing new. There are a few still in existence today, the most known of which is attempting to carve space out of an area that encompasses parts of Louisiana, I think. The difference is these groups have done a lot more than go on a board and call people stupid for not following them. They articulated a vision, processes and reasons. They have laid out a platform by which believers can participate and make things happen. You have not done that.

Also, you constantly cite Moses as the model, with you in the role of Moses. Now, the glaring difference there is that Moses did more than just call the Jews ignorant and dumb for not following him. He not only offered a vision but was validated by God in terms of being a prophet. The Jews were fools to not follow him as they had plenty of evidence that he was who he said he was. You have offered none of that, other than your word. Faith is what it is, however what you present and the way you present it does not provide any evidence of any leadership on your part. As I said to you before, leaders become leaders not because they force or shame people into following them. But by dint of their ability to articulate a vision, live by that example people WANT to follow them. In every case throughout history, all those who were great leaders, for “good” or “bad” had followers come to that because they were impressed by their leadership; e.g. you have to do more than say it, you have to show it.

And now for some honesty: to me you appear to be someone in thrall with white supremacy. You want blacks to accept inferiority and have that be the basis for forming a new nation. Its repulsive and embarrassing to me as a black man to read you repeatedly put down our people on the basis of white supremacy that has been the underpinnings of colonialism, racism, slavery, etc. You are essentially calling on the formation of sovereignty from a position and basis of weakness instead of strength. I and many if not most blacks consider themselves in the warrior tradition, if for no other reasons than the strength they have to muster on a regular basis to get by and move forward. To repeatedly tell people like this that they are weak, stupid and inferior, and that the only recourse is to cut and run, and expecting that to resonate, is insane.

As I said to you before, we have to have the mental vision first, to see ourselves as free and capable. Blacks have done that, and hence where we are today. To discount as you do all that black people have done and achieved to date, and still insist, repeatedly, that they are inferior to whites, is a big part of your problem. First because it is not true, but second, and more importantly, by insistently pretending it is true you undermine your own credibility.

In summary then, it’s hard for anyone to evaluate whether your idea has any merit, because you have not articulated a vision. Secondly, in insisting that you are a prophet, absent any evidence of anything prophetic, you come off as a charlatan. Third, and lastly, by relying so heavily on the stereotypes of white supremacy vis-à-vis THE reason anyone should follow you, you shoot yourself in the foot before you take the first step, which is the first point above, articulation of a vision.

In essence, its time to realize what you are doing is not working. Try something different!

PS – I disagree with those who delete your posts and say you do not have a right to post. I believe in freedom of speech and your right to say what’s on your mind. However, freedom of speech works both ways and thus I agree also with those who respond as they do to what you write.

Wednesday, August 5th 2009 at 11:33AM
Harry Watley
const. contractor/ retired at self
Hello Mr. C. Maxwell,

I think you have misunderstood me about the hundred percent rejections to the concept of our own sovereignty as a permanent solution to our repeated complaining and whining.

In other words, the concept of sovereignty as a permanent solution is because of the complaining and whining. For example, the concept of the Exodus as a permanent solution was because the Hebrew people griping and complaining about their bondage, and rightfully so. Therefore, in no way Moses should have abandoned the Exodus and try something else, because it was one hundred percent rejected in the early part of his ministry.

What was rejected by Moses, were the things being done as a means of resolving their bondage by the leaders or elders of the Hebrew people. As it is with me, what I am rejecting is how you all repeatedly whine, complain and yet resorting to the same strategy as the previous generations as a means of resolving our subjugation in White America. For instance, every time a Black person is innocently killed our leaders call for a full investigation by the Justice Department. You know that I am not telling you anything wrong.

The bottom line is Mr. Maxwell is that American Blacks rejects their own sovereignty, because it is something new to them and they are very much afraid of being on their own. Even, you do not want to be on your own, you psychologically and physically feel that you need the support of White people, or else he would not make it in life, am I right?

Consequentially the insanity clause of repeating the same strategy is pointed towards you, the rest of Black Americans, and the Hebrew elders and not on Moses or me.

Now, as far as me having neither vision nor articulation skills are irrelevant. Sovereignty, complete independence or autonomy fundamentally speaking, the meanings of these ideologies are self-sufficient, just on their face. I want us to be free people, how much vision and articulation do I need to give you?

Mr. Maxwell sovereignty, complete independence or autonomy is far remove from the concept of separation. I do not want separation. The concept of separation is entirely different from the concept of sovereignty, and perhaps this may be the reason why you do not understand me.

So, the suggestion that you offered me is to try something different. However, if I do, that means you and American Blacks will remain in subjugation to continue your whining and complaining. Likewise, if Moses had tried something different from the Exodus, his people theoretically speaking would still be in bondage. I sincerely would like to put a permanent stop to the whining and complaining that you all do, repeatedly.

What say you?

Wednesday, August 5th 2009 at 4:16PM

Business/Systems Analyst at MITC
You totally missed it Harry. And you have just demonstrated you are incapable.

I tried, but I am done.

Wednesday, August 5th 2009 at 4:44PM
Harry Watley
const. contractor/ retired at self
Hello Mr. C. Maxwell,

I do not think I missed anything.

Your first point had to do with IQ test more or less acculturation rather than thinking abilities. I did not comment on this point, because I feel that a person’s IQ measures his abilities to function properly in his/her culture or environment. Therefore, your thinking abilities and your culture goes hand in hand and not separate.

Your second point had to do with my desire that American Blacks become an independent of sovereign people that nauseated you. Well, that is my point that I having a 68 IQ would understand that sovereignty would be our permanent solution and simultaneously elevating Black Americans to the status of real people. Then of course your whining and complaining would be curtailed. Now, with you having an above average IQ, e.g. you are more intelligent than I am, do not see what I see. I want to cause to you all continuing whining and complaining. Should you not want an end to your whining and complaining? But, your advice to me is that perhaps something is wrong with me and not you that I should change my solution of sovereignty, to allow you all to continue to whine and complain. How do you explain that, Mr. Maxwell?

So, I really do not think I missed anything. What I do know is that you do not want to take responsibility of being a real man and neither does the women. Real men and their women are free and sovereign people that would gladly braved the natural obstacles that nature hurdles at them as a resistance while they pursue Life, Liberty, Happiness, and Prosperity for themselves. But you seem to think that something is wrong with me for cradling the concept of our sovereignty.

I am confident that you and the rest of my people who are presently rejecting their sovereignty will have a change of mind in time to come.

What say you?

Wednesday, August 5th 2009 at 7:21PM
Steve Williams
None at None
Harry, you say does anyone have a positive suggestion for you? But do you know a positive suggestion when you see one?

I don't know what an IQ of 68 is and I don't care. I've not questioned your intelligence, but I've been told that I am speaking gibberish, because I try to speak truth from the heart.

There is a great truth that you've not taken to heart, not from me, but from those who have greater claim as your brother and sister, who have shown you love.

So I will speak some more gibberish: It is said, God is love. So then, is not love God? Or is your sovereignty higher than God?
Wednesday, August 5th 2009 at 9:19PM
Harry Watley
const. contractor/ retired at self
Hello Ms. Irma,

You said this in reference to me, “A person who is sloely DEPENDANT on others to even begin to start the first move towards working towards their goal is already a failure.”

I believe that I have taken the first step towards my goal and that is to plant the seed of sovereignty in your mind, which is the only permanent solution that we have ever to become a real people in this world. Therefore, I do not think that I am a failure already. Perhaps it is that you do not understand what I am saying.

I believe that Moses done the same thing when he planted the seed of the Exodus in the minds of his Hebrew people as the only permanent solution to their bondage and if ever they wanted to become a real people in the ancient world they must leave Egypt. The spectacular thing about it all is that God is with me as God was with Moses.

Then, you made a comparison and contrast to my concept of sovereignty that you owned a piece of real estate. However, this piece of property ultimately belongs to White American people since they presently owns the entire continent of America. We know that the White American people, owns the real estate of America since been names are affixed to the Declaration of Independence. We also know that the document of the Declaration of Independence serves the same purpose as the registration of your car, which tells whom the car belongs. This tells me that you really do not understand anything that I have been saying all this time.

Look at it this way, suppose the Hebrew people had told Moses that they owned a piece of property in the ghettos of Egypt as the equivalent of the concept of the Exodus God gave to Moses to free his people, the Hebrew people would still have been in Egypt today, theoretically speaking, am I right?

I gave you this example to say your property has no comparison to the concept of our sovereignty.

What say you?

Thursday, August 6th 2009 at 5:28AM
Harry Watley
const. contractor/ retired at self
Hello Steve,

You said this, “It is said, God is love. So then, is not love God?”

God is not love and love is not God. Love is an emotion God made a part of man when the breath of life was breadth in to him by God and man became a living soul.

Love is the same as conscience, hate, anger, etc.

Now, the concept of Black Americans sovereignty is what God gave to me as American Blacks only permanent solution to our subjugation in White America. Therefore, your question, whether my concept of sovereignty is above God is a flawed question or moot.

What say you?

Thursday, August 6th 2009 at 6:13AM
Harry Watley
const. contractor/ retired at self
Hello Ms. Irma,

My point was not whether owning property is better than not owning property. My point is that your property, along with all the other properties Black American owns in White America does not translate into sovereignty of American Blacks.

Secondly, Moses is not important to me per se. What are important on the humanitarian side are the principles and morals that the bondage of the Hebrew people and God’s helping them portrays. Whether Moses was White is not important.

I never said anything about building a kingdom. I never use the word kingdom. I use the word sovereignty or complete independence from White America on a portion of this continent. I never said anything about building a kingdom in America. Therefore, why do you deliberately misquote me?

As I said before, I have an IQ of 68, which just barely pass the threshold of retardation, yet I can see things that you do not see while you have an above average IQ. How do you explain that Ms. Irma?

What say you?

Thursday, August 6th 2009 at 6:17PM
UC, Davis class of 1992
Harry, no excuse is acceptable by responsible peoples for another persons irrational behaviors, failuars or their not doings something to show an example of their own goals.

A person who is sloely DEPENDANT on others to even begin to start the first move towards working towards their goal is already a failure. for example, Ms Tudman did not just talk about her goals, she was the 'active' part in her goals from the beginings to the end. When she could not find others to take her up on trying to help them help themselves she continued on because she had a mission to make successful. She never blamed others for not accepting or having any faith in her mission in any way form or fashion as you are doing.Mr. Obama did not wait for someone else to be other than a White male to get enough votes to become a MAN of color being able to move into the Whitehouse.He went out and worked hard and long in his choice to become this person himself!!!!!Am I correct?

I did not wait for you to get my own part of America to call my very own, I knew what I wanted ,worked very hard to get it and now I have it. My own private property that I am the soul boss of and I am very, very happy...I can make rules and requlations that are good for me and if one does not like it then they can leave...I will be able to survive and still have or produce every thing I need if I never step foot of my property or no White man ever set foot on my property.(smile)

but, Harry all that I have learned or have chosen to reject in my life will still be with me, because life is a process which we can deny but can never erase completely from our reality...thses are things tha have made me the best person that I can be.(smile)

Harry, please start your journey by respecting and loving yourself first and far most...And, know that "I" am your friend and only hope the very best for you in all things...
Thursday, April 10th 2014 at 6:47PM
UC, Davis class of 1992
Harry, I do chant (pray) that you have not chosen to believe taht we or anyone is rejecting you for having a 68 IQ. If any thing if you have a 68 IQ then please for give me for believing that your behaviors and your rational came from being a NUT...I have more respect for you and will be able to try to be more understanding...but, even in doing this ,Harry can pose a danger to you by making you even more prone to feeling sorry for your self, by accusing us on the site of rejecting you because "we think we are smarter then you"

Trying to be your friend can be more of a loose, loose for all involved with you Harry...
Thursday, April 10th 2014 at 6:47PM
UC, Davis class of 1992
This is your problem Harry, isn't owning property in the ghetto much better than owning no property at all? And, why did you say ghetto or is this a put down on the very people you are modeling your self after?!? You can not see the HOME for seeing the house...

Was Moses a Jew or like the White man and if so then are you not still basing your freedom on the White man?!?!?

And, Egypt was taken out of Africa by the White man, so what Bible are you basing your out look ,expertes on if not the teachings of the White man???????You can not run away from your own self as you always take your mental and physical body with you where ever you go...this is my point and what Clark was trying to get across to you Harry.You are arguing in circles or begging the question......................
Thursday, April 10th 2014 at 6:47PM
UC, Davis class of 1992
* please go to what you said about the White man OWNING 'ALL' OF THE LAND...and did you say you would be building you kingdom in America so that you can get away from the White man, Harry. How is this possible if you will be dependant on the White man to help you to get where you want to go??????????but, as per usual you will just over look any form of rationality/sanity,etc.

So I will now go take a break from Harry's reality...
Thursday, April 10th 2014 at 6:47PM
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